John Ginn of Thorley d. c.1800

John here is son of John of Farnham in my post of  23rd March 2013. 

But I have chosen to begin this story early on, with a certain William Phillips who married a Mary Mallyon at Thorley in 1757. The couple had three children: James, John and Mary, before John died in infancy and his mother followed soon after in August 1763.

William immediately remarried, his new wife (Martha Nicolson) marrying him in Bishop’s Stortford in 1764 and having two further children (William & Sarah) before William himself died at Thorley in 1770.

William’s daughter Mary Phillips (born in 1763) married a certain John Waters at Thorley in 1781.  Waters was a labourer and the couple had five children before John’s untimely death in August 1789.  These children are important to this narrative and were as follows: Mary (1782) William (1783) Martha (1785) John (1787) and James (1790)

                       

Mary obviously had problems, with five young children and no father to provide for them.  John Ginn had arrived in Thorley (Militia List) in 1787. It looks like he travelled with his sister Ann.  His Farnham origins were confirmed by DNA matches in late 2022.  He was “living in” locally as an agricultural servant and in November 1790 he quite bravely took on Mary Waters (“widow”) and her children, all of whom were clearly alive at this date.

It was the fact that John had taken on a “ready made” family that influenced the choice of names for his own sons; a choice that had always puzzled me.  For Mary could scarcely have further sons by John that were given either his name or those traditional to the Farnham clan: i.e. John, James and William.  A little originality was thus in order.

The couple had a further five children, all sons, then John Ginn is known to have died between 1799 and 1801 as Mary is thereafter referred to as a widow in local charity records (D/P 108 25/1 etc. at HRO).  John has no burial entry at Thorley or in any other local register and it is just possible that he became worn down with the responsibility of providing for so many children and absconded, leaving his children in the care of the parish.  Three of his Ginn nephews at various times attempted the same.

John was a labourer and this couple were certainly poor, not least because of the number of children.  In 1799 the local charity doled out bread for the family, at that time counting them with 7 children, though most probably only children under 11 or 12 were considered eligible infants and unable to work on a permanent basis.  Widow Ginn and her children continued to receive bread for the next few years, and as the family’s circumstances were now dire it is certain that steps were taken to find early employment for the kids.

It is known that William, Martha and John Waters survived childhood: both William and Martha later marrying and John being mentioned in records compiled under the 1803 Defence Acts.  

In 1805 Mary had an illegitimate son - Frederick Ginn (see below).  She eventually got her elder children off her hands and in 1812 remarried a William Wrist (generally Rist) which though an unusual surname was not uncommon in the villages of nearby Widford and the Hadhams.  It seems clear that the William Rist in question was born in Little Hadham in 1760, because it was that chap who was later at Much Hadham, where Mary is known to have been living in 1814.  For in 1814 she received the little property and effects left by her deceased son Samuel, the army records (WO 25 2967 at the PRO) giving her address in July 1814 as “Much Hadham, Bishops Stortford, Herts”. William Rist died there in 1831 with Mary apparently still alive - I have not yet researched Mary further.

John and Mary had five sons

Samuel - went to war with the 95th Foot and was killed in 1813 - see post of 26th January 2013.  He gets more "hits" on his post on this site than anybody else save one here - a fitting memorial

George - see next post

David - see later post 

Benjamin - he married Mary Brace at Tottenham in 1825.  There is no trace of the pair thereafter

Charles - see later post

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Frederick - obviously not a “blood” Ginn.  Frederick was the subject of a maintenance order in 1806 against a Richard Osborn.  In  1811, he is mentioned in surviving records, being given a New Testament and Prayer book that year (Charity papers: HRO).  That he lived seemed certain, his half-brother Charles naming a son after him.

He was finally found in 2010.  He joined the army and died in York Hospital (in Chelsea) for wounded soldiers in 1827 aged 22.   We were not at war then and I suspect he died of tuberculosis.  I do not yet know which regiment he joined and it would be a nice touch to find he joined the Rifle Brigade (the former 95th)